Did Brigham Young Support Slavery? (A Formal Debate)

Key Concepts

• Brigham Young's views on slavery
• 1852 speech to the Utah legislature
• Chattel slavery vs. indentured servitude
• Political context of Brigham Young's statements
• The curse of Cain/Ham
• Free agency vs. compulsion
• Historical perspectives on race and slavery
• Brigham Young's actions vs. his words
• The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints' stance on slavery

Main Topics and Key Points

Opening Statements

• Darth Modello's (DM) Opening Statement:

  • The debate centers on whether Brigham Young supported slavery.
  • DM acknowledges Brigham Young's 1852 speech to the Utah legislature as evidence of his support for slavery.
  • DM highlights Brigham Young's theological perspective that all humans are servants, with some being "holy slaves of slaves."
  • DM argues that Brigham Young's support for slavery is inconsistent with the Church's theology of the value of human beings and free agency.
  • DM expresses concern that dismissing Brigham Young's support for slavery is a form of "gaslighting" within the ex-Mormon community.
  • DM suggests that Brigham Young's view of the Saints as resources ("drones of the Beehive") is revealed in his stance on slavery.
  • DM emphasizes the importance of objectivity and fairness in discussing historical issues.
  • DM acknowledges that Brigham Young was a product of his time, similar to Abraham Lincoln, who also held views that would be considered unacceptable today.

• Jacob Hess's (JH) Opening Statement:

  • JH acknowledges that Brigham Young was racist, holding views typical of Northerners in the early 1800s.
  • JH argues that holding racist views does not necessarily equate to supporting chattel slavery.
  • JH points out that Brigham Young made statements both supporting and opposing slavery.
  • JH emphasizes the political and historical context of Brigham Young's 1852 speech, arguing it was political theater to gain support for Utah's statehood.
  • JH cites William Douglas's article in the Latter-Day Liberator, which suggests that Brigham Young's pro-slavery rhetoric was a way to secure support from Southern politicians while implementing a gradual emancipation law.
  • JH describes the Utah system as a form of indentured servitude with guaranteed rights and benefits, including comfortable housing, recreation time, health benefits, education, and legal protection from abuse.
  • JH emphasizes that children born to indentured servants in Utah were born free, ensuring the end of slavery as an institution.
  • JH contrasts the Utah system with the de facto slavery of impoverished white factory workers in the mid-1800s.
  • JH concludes that Brigham Young opposed chattel slavery and created legislation to end the practice, even though he held racist views.

Rebuttals

• DM's Rebuttal:

  • DM agrees with many of JH's points, acknowledging the political realities of Brigham Young's time.
  • DM maintains that Brigham Young held a specific, negative view of African Americans, believing they were cursed.
  • DM reiterates that Brigham Young's support for slavery is inconsistent with the expectation of insight and evolved perspective from a prophet.
  • DM acknowledges Brigham Young's accomplishments but struggles with the prophet claim due to his stance on slavery.
  • DM emphasizes the importance of giving grace to those who struggle with faith due to historical issues like Brigham Young's views on slavery.

• JH's Rebuttal:

  • JH reiterates that the debate is about whether Brigham Young supported chattel slavery, not whether he was a prophet or racist.
  • JH emphasizes that Brigham Young explicitly rejected chattel slavery and supported a system of indentured servitude with guaranteed rights.
  • JH argues that Brigham Young's program was a transition out of slavery, similar to what was done in other countries.
  • JH mentions the story of Green Flake, a slave who was freed by Brigham Young.
  • JH acknowledges that Brigham Young believed in the curse of Cain and that the Bible tolerated some form of servitude.
  • JH concludes that Brigham Young was doing his best to implement something consistent with what the Bible would tolerate, at least temporarily, in Utah.

Cross-Examination

• DM's Questions to JH:

  • DM asks about the adversary's plan to rob man of their agency through compulsion.
  • DM asks for the definition of slavery, focusing on ownership and restriction of agency.
  • DM questions whether Brigham Young believed in indentured servitude or slavery.
  • DM questions whether Brigham Young understood the difference between indentured servitude and slavery.
  • DM questions whether Brigham Young's support for slavery was to appease Southern politicians.
  • DM questions whether Utah was trying to be admitted to the Union.
  • DM questions whether Brigham Young had just lost political control of Deseret.

• JH's Answers to DM:

  • JH states that the adversary's plan was to rob man of their agency and guarantee that none would be lost through compulsion.
  • JH defines slavery as the coerced labor of another and ownership of another by another human being.
  • JH states that Brigham Young used the word slavery but was not referring to the ownership of other human beings.
  • JH states that Brigham Young was using the term slavery to appease Southern politicians.
  • JH states that Utah was looking to try and get at least territorial status.
  • JH states that the state of Deseret did have to be dissolved shortly after.

• JH's Questions to DM:

  • JH asks why Brigham Young would say he was opposed to slavery if he supported it.
  • JH asks why Brigham Young would say that human flesh should not be dealt with as property if he believed in slavery.
  • JH asks if DM agrees there is a contradiction in the quotes.
  • JH asks if the Utah law allowed people to own other people.
  • JH asks if the Utah law allowed people to bring their slaves into Utah.
  • JH asks why Brigham Young would say that no property can or should be recognized as existing in slaves.
  • JH asks if slaves have a right to testify in court.
  • JH asks if the Utah law guaranteed freedom for the children of indentured servants.

• DM's Answers to JH:

  • DM states that Brigham Young was politically adept and knew it was wise to speak in certain terms.
  • DM states that Brigham Young was opposed to the abuse of human beings.
  • DM states that he does not know why Brigham Young would say that human flesh should not be dealt with as property.
  • DM states that he believes Brigham Young was speaking out of both sides of his mouth.
  • DM states that he is speculating but thinks Brigham Young was trying to establish that slaves could not be physically abused.
  • DM states that he does not know if families were allowed to be split up under the Utah law.
  • DM states that he thinks there was some mention of education in the Indian case.
  • DM states that he thinks Brigham Young probably had an incentive to use racist language and the word slavery to gain support.
  • DM states that he thinks Brigham Young was referring to chattel slavery minus the physical abuse.
  • DM states that he does not know if chattel slavery allowed people to be brought across state lines without their consent.

• DM's Questions to JH (Round 2):

  • DM asks if it is contradictory to believe in taking away a person's rights if they also believe in free agency.
  • DM asks if it is contradictory to take away somebody's rights without their consent.
  • DM asks if Brigham Young used his political power to establish laws that supported, protected, and created slavery in the state of Utah.
  • DM asks if JH would have granted full political equality if he were in Brigham Young's shoes.
  • DM asks if it is fair for people to feel offended by what Brigham Young did and to question his integrity because of it.

• JH's Answers to DM (Round 2):

  • JH states that it is immoral to enslave other human beings and to have a government system that does not grant full equal rights.
  • JH states that Brigham Young created a system of temporary indentured servitude that would end the institution of slavery ultimately.
  • JH states that he would have granted full political equality.
  • JH states that it is fair to question what Brigham Young did and to be very critical of it with hindsight.

• JH's Questions to DM (Round 2):

  • JH asks if the Utah 1852 law abolished the slave class and replaced it with an indentured servant class.
  • JH asks what kind of rights were guaranteed by the 1852 law for indentured servants.
  • JH asks what would happen if those people were abused.
  • JH asks if families were allowed to be split up under the Utah law.
  • JH asks if education was guaranteed for the servants under this law.
  • JH asks if Brigham Young had an incentive in 1852 to use racist language and to use the word slavery to gain support.
  • JH asks if Brigham Young was referring to chattel slavery when he used the word slavery.
  • JH asks if chattel slavery allowed people to be brought across state lines without their consent.
  • JH asks if the Utah law allowed slaves to be brought to Utah without their consent.
  • JH asks if politicians sometimes engage in political theater and speak hyperbolically.
  • JH asks if DM has any quotes from Brigham saying that he supported slavery outside of that speech from 1852.

• DM's Answers to JH (Round 2):

  • DM states that he is not sure if the Utah 1852 law abolished the slave class.
  • DM states that he thinks Brigham Young was trying to establish that slaves could not be physically abused.
  • DM states that he imagines there was some kind of penalty within the law if those people were abused.
  • DM states that he does not know if families were allowed to be split up under the Utah law.
  • DM states that he remembers some mention of education.
  • DM states that he thinks Brigham Young probably did have an incentive to use racist language and to use the word slavery to gain support.
  • DM states that he thinks Brigham Young was referring to chattel slavery minus the physical abuse.
  • DM states that he does not know if chattel slavery allowed people to be brought across state lines without their consent.
  • DM states that he thinks his understanding is that the Utah law did not let slaves leave the state without their consent.
  • DM states that politicians sometimes engage in political theater.
  • DM states that he does not have any readily available quotes from Brigham saying that he supported slavery outside of that speech from 1852.

Closing Statements

• DM's Closing Statement:

  • DM believes that Brigham Young clearly stated that he supported slavery.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young did not go out of his way to say that what he supported was indentured servitude.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young's position was effectively the same position that in the church we teach is essentially the adversary's position.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young was believing that domestication of other people was absolutely fine.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young definitely supported slavery and in some ways he believed in it deeply.
  • DM believes that it is contradictory to believe in free agency and to believe that it is okay to own people.
  • DM believes that it is whitewashing and sugar coating to say that there were good reasons why Brigham Young said what he said or did what he did.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young makes it very clear in that speech that he is not just trying to bow to the powers that be.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young is trying to state what he believes is integral to his own personal belief system.
  • DM believes that Brigham Young definitely believes that blacks are different than whites.
  • DM believes that a belief system should not create that type of an arrangement for another person.

• JH's Closing Statement:

  • JH reiterates that the debate is not about if slavery was wrong or if Brigham Young was racist.
  • JH reiterates that the question was if Brigham Young supported slavery and that people have something in mind when they say that.
  • JH reiterates that Brigham Young was a typical northerner who opposed slavery but did not support full political equality of the races.
  • JH states that DM seemed to have changed his arguments later in the debate and began to talk about how Brigham Young actually did believe in chattel slavery.
  • JH states that chattel means property and that Brigham Young, Abraham Lincoln, and Joseph Smith all opposed chattel slavery.
  • JH states that DM ignores or does not think Brigham Young is being honest when he says that human flesh should not be dealt with as property.
  • JH states that Brigham Young had a political incentive to try and get these Southern States on his side.
  • JH states that the legislation dismantles slavery and actually would end it.
  • JH states that the idea that Brigham Young supported chattel slavery is simply not supported by the historic record.
  • JH states that Brigham Young was doing what he could within the context that he could to actually end the practice.
  • JH states that Brigham Young did hold racist views still and he did believe that it could be justified under certain conditions.
  • JH states that in Doctrine and Covenants 101:79 it says therefore it is not right that any man should be in bondage one to another.
  • JH states that in the Book of Mormon it says that God denieth none to come unto him black or white bonder-free male or female.
  • JH states that the church and the Gospel of Jesus Christ is anti-slavery.
  • JH states that if Brigham Young ever supported any of it it was wrong but he did not support the slavery of his day.

Important Examples, Case Studies, or Real-World Applications Discussed

• Abraham Lincoln: Used as a comparison to Brigham Young, highlighting that both held racist views typical of their time but opposed chattel slavery.
• The State of Deseret: Mentioned as a political entity that Brigham Young was involved with, and its dissolution is relevant to the political context of the 1852 speech.
• Utah's 1852 Law: The central example of Brigham Young's actions regarding slavery, with JH arguing it dismantled slavery and DM arguing it supported it.
• Green Flake: A slave who was freed by Brigham Young, used as an example of Brigham Young's actions against slavery.
• Impoverished White Factory Workers: Contrasted with the indentured servants in Utah to show that the Utah system provided more benefits.

Step-by-Step Processes, Methodologies, or Frameworks Explained

• The Utah System of Indentured Servitude:
  1. Abolished the category of slave where a person was property.
  2. Ensured any indentured servant received recompense for their services.
  3. Provided comfortable housing, recreation time, health benefits, and education for them and their family.
  4. Ensured they had the legal rights needed to protect them from any physical or sexual abuse.
  5. No slave could be brought to Utah unless the slave consented to come and assume their new role.
  6. Any children born to these indentured servants in Utah were born free.

Key Arguments or Perspectives Presented, with Their Supporting Evidence

• DM's Argument: Brigham Young supported slavery, evidenced by his 1852 speech and his theological views.

  • Supporting Evidence: Direct quotes from the 1852 speech where Brigham Young states his belief in slavery.
  • Supporting Evidence: Brigham Young's view of African Americans as cursed.
  • Supporting Evidence: The belief that Brigham Young's actions are inconsistent with the Church's theology of free agency.

• JH's Argument: Brigham Young opposed chattel slavery, evidenced by his actions and the political context of his statements.

  • Supporting Evidence: Quotes from Brigham Young opposing the abuse and ownership of human beings.
  • Supporting Evidence: The details of the Utah system of indentured servitude, which provided rights and benefits to servants.
  • Supporting Evidence: The political context of the 1852 speech, arguing it was political theater to gain support for Utah's statehood.

Notable Quotes or Significant Statements with Proper Attribution

• Brigham Young: "I am not nor have ever been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races." (Attributed to Abraham Lincoln by JH to show the common views of the time)
• Brigham Young: "We must believe in slavery." (From the 1852 speech, cited by JH)
• Brigham Young: "I am as much opposed to the principle of slavery as any man in the present usage of the term." (Cited by JH)
• Brigham Young: "Human flesh to be dealt in as property is not consistent or compatible with the true principles of government." (Cited by JH)
• Brigham Young: "My own feelings are that no property can or should be recognized as existing enslaves either Indian or African no person can purchase them without their becoming as free so far as natural rights are concerned as persons of any other color end quote" (Cited by JH)
• William Douglas: "Why else would Brigham who was in fact supporting a law that would turn Utah into a de facto free territory speak in any way that would seemingly endorse slavery at the exact same time and why would he give a pro-slavery speech only a month after he publicly and completely denounced slavery altogether the whole thing sounds like political theater he understood that Utah would never be admitted as an official free territory he knew Utah would never get the support of Southern politicians necessary to become a state if Utah openly denounced slavery so he did something incredibly cagey he supported a gradual emancipation law but couched it in expressly racist and pro-slavery terms end quote" (Cited by JH)

Technical Terms, Concepts, or Specialized Vocabulary with Brief Explanations

• Chattel Slavery: A system in which human beings are treated as property and can be bought, sold, and owned.
• Indentured Servitude: A system in which a person is bound by a contract to work for another for a specified period of time, often in exchange for passage to a new country or other benefits.
• Free Agency: The ability to choose and act for oneself.
• Compulsion: The act of coercing or forcing someone to do something against their will.
• Curse of Cain/Ham: A theological concept used to justify the enslavement of Africans.
• Political Theater: The use of political actions and statements for symbolic or propagandistic purposes.
• Gaslighting: A form of psychological manipulation in which a person or group secretly undermines another's sanity by leading them to question their own reality.
• Realpolitik: A system of politics or principles based on practical rather than moral or ideological considerations.

Logical Connections Between Different Sections and Ideas

• The opening statements set the stage for the debate, with DM arguing that Brigham Young supported slavery and JH arguing that he opposed chattel slavery.
• The rebuttals allow each debater to respond to the other's arguments and clarify their positions.
• The cross-examination allows each debater to ask questions and challenge the other's evidence and reasoning.
• The closing statements allow each debater to summarize their arguments and make a final appeal to the audience.
• The debate revolves around the interpretation of Brigham Young's words and actions, with DM focusing on the 1852 speech and JH focusing on the political context and the details of the Utah system.

Any Data, Research Findings, or Statistics Mentioned

• The debate references William Douglas's article in the Latter-Day Liberator, which provides an analysis of Brigham Young's 1852 speech.
• The debate mentions the historical context of the 1850s, including the debate over the expansion of slavery into new territories and states.

Brief Synthesis/Conclusion of the Main Takeaways

The debate centers on whether Brigham Young supported slavery. DM argues that Brigham Young's 1852 speech and theological views demonstrate his support for slavery, while JH argues that Brigham Young opposed chattel slavery and that his statements should be interpreted in the context of the political realities of his time. The debate highlights the complexities of interpreting historical figures and the importance of considering both their words and their actions. While both debaters agree that Brigham Young held racist views, they disagree on whether he supported the institution of chattel slavery. JH argues that Brigham Young's actions, particularly the implementation of the Utah system of indentured servitude, demonstrate his opposition to chattel slavery, while DM argues that Brigham Young's words, particularly his statements in the 1852 speech, demonstrate his support for slavery. Ultimately, the debate leaves the audience to consider the evidence and draw their own conclusions about Brigham Young's views on slavery.